Is chili a soup? [Archive]

UVaAmbassador

12-10-2008, 02:00 PM

I was in a dumb argument about this the other day and thought I'd submit it to the board where no subject is to bizarre.

Is chili a soup?

Its usually listed under the "Soup and Salad" portion of the menu, but its typically with the beans, not the soups, in grocery stores and unlike soup, which is traditionally an appetizer, chili often constitutes its own meal. On the other hand, the same can be said of beef stew and a seafood chowder. Now I'm rambling. Thoughts?

Fish80

12-10-2008, 02:06 PM

If chili is a soup, then it was made wrong.

Do you put soup on your hotdog? Or your burger? Q.E.D.

:D

ohioguy2

12-10-2008, 02:09 PM

Turk

12-10-2008, 02:11 PM

Chili is stew, not soup. However, most restaurants do not have enough offerings to devote an entire section of the menu to stews (alas). So the term "soup" on a menu actually means "hot food that comes in a bowl but is not an entree".

Cheers,
Mr. Language Person

bjornolf

12-10-2008, 02:14 PM

Kind of depends on the chili, IMHO.

Fish80

12-10-2008, 02:14 PM

It is liquid food--very good liquid food--I, therefore, believe it is a soup. We are having white bean chicken chili tonight--my wife is not only lovely, but one heck of a soup maker. I will review the beer I am having with the soup on the beer thread. :)

You are sadly mistaken, my friend. Not all liquids are created equal. Is water a soup? Is O.J. a soup? I think not. This proves, by induction, that not all liquids are soups. :D

DukieInKansas

12-10-2008, 02:45 PM

It is liquid food--very good liquid food--I, therefore, believe it is a soup. We are having white bean chicken chili tonight--my wife is not only lovely, but one heck of a soup maker. I will review the beer I am having with the soup on the beer thread. :)

Rather than the beer review, please ask Mrs. ohioguy2 to add the recipe to the recipe thread.

I went with no on the poll - it is a stew.

eta - Webster's defines it as a sauce.

juise

12-10-2008, 02:56 PM

It's chili. Do you refer to it as chili soup? Do you refer to it as chili stew? Do you refer to it as chili chowder? No, no, no. Chili.

Fish80

12-10-2008, 02:58 PM

It's chili. Do you refer to it as chili soup? Do you refer to it as chili stew? Do you refer to it as chili chowder? No, no, no. Chili.

Chili tonight, hot tamale! :eek:

DukieInKansas

12-10-2008, 03:01 PM

Chili tonight, hot tamale! :eek:

Yes - I knew I could count on you, my partner in puns. :D

Congrats on Gene Banks status.

Turk

12-10-2008, 03:12 PM

Rather than the beer review, please ask Mrs. ohioguy2 to add the recipe to the recipe thread.

I went with no on the poll - it is a stew.

eta - Webster's defines it as a sauce.

Yeah, but chili sauce is usually one of the ingredients, as is chili powder, as are actual chilis themselves, meaning some variety of pepper.

So, juise, I think the term "chili" is not quite precise enough in this context.

juise

12-10-2008, 03:21 PM

Webster calls it a sauce. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/chili)

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 04:11 PM

Chili is most definitely NOT a soup. Soups use stock/broth/water as a base, to which other little yummy bits are added. The base for chili is meat and that meat is simmered in a liquid (some like more, some like less). That my friends is the definition of a stew.

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 04:13 PM

Webster calls it a sauce. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/chili)
Webster's is correct but I think the application is too literal here. The chili most of us love and adore is actually chili con carne. We shorten it to chili.

ohioguy2

12-10-2008, 04:14 PM

You are sadly mistaken, my friend. Not all liquids are created equal. Is water a soup? Is O.J. a soup? I think not. This proves, by induction, that not all liquids are soups. :D

I then say (with a smile on my face), if you put the water or juice in a bowl and ate it with a spoon, it would be a soup. If you put the chili on a hot dog, it is a condiment. In a bowl, chili is a soup.;)

ForeverBlowingBubbles

12-10-2008, 04:18 PM

chili is not a soup.

thats like saying Sarah Palin is qualified to be president just because she wears presidential cloths (as in comparison to chili being served in a bowl)

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 04:27 PM

DukeUsul

12-10-2008, 04:33 PM

chili is definitley a stew

ohioguy2

12-10-2008, 04:56 PM

chili is definitley a stew

This is fun--stew=thick soup.:D

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 05:06 PM

This is fun--stew=thick soup.:D
That doesn't account for the quantity and size of ingredients. Try again. :)

Fish80

12-10-2008, 05:06 PM

I then say (with a smile on my face), if you put the water or juice in a bowl and ate it with a spoon, it would be a soup. If you put the chili on a hot dog, it is a condiment. In a bowl, chili is a soup.;)

I wanted to stay Gene Banks a little longer, but this chili topic is too important.

I give my dogs water, in a bowl. It's still water, not soup, not chili. :D

I order my hot dog with chili, not with chili flavored soup and not with chili stew substance. ;)

One time in Italy I ate wild boar stew. It was not chili. :)

Fish80

12-10-2008, 05:07 PM

chili is not a soup.

thats like saying Sarah Palin is qualified to be president just because she wears presidential cloths (as in comparison to chili being served in a bowl)

Sarah Palin eats moose chili, not moose soup.

UVaAmbassador

12-10-2008, 05:08 PM

That doesn't account for the quantity and size of ingredients. Try again. :)

It does lead to an interesting question as to when a soup becomes a stew. A chili could, in theory, be more watery than a thick and meaty pasta fagole (sp?) and yet most would seem to classify the former as a stew and the latter a soup. Clearly thickness cannot be the criteria. What then?

Fish80

12-10-2008, 05:08 PM

Yes - I knew I could count on you, my partner in puns. :D

Congrats on Gene Banks status.

If your soup is chili, you should heat it in the microwave! :eek:

Turk

12-10-2008, 05:13 PM

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 05:15 PM

It does lead to an interesting question as to when a soup becomes a stew. A chili could, in theory, be more watery than a thick and meaty pasta fagole (sp?) and yet most would seem to classify the former as a stew and the latter a soup. Clearly thickness cannot be the criteria. What then?
A chili that is more watery than meaty pasta isn't ready to eat yet. Or you could just call it dog food, or maybe call it Chili Soup :)

A soup becomes a stew when the chef decides:

to add more ingredients to the pot, thereby decreasing the broth:chunk ratio
reduce the temperature and cook the concoction longer (anyone ever wonder why stew is also a verb?)

Guess what's for dinner Saturday

2535Miles

12-10-2008, 05:39 PM

I think 2535 has it right. If you start with meat, it's stew.... If you start with water and throw in noodles or veggies or bits of meat, it's soup....

What about gumbo? I believe that starts with roux, which is flour and butter. Is that soup or a stew?
Great question. Unfortunately, I don't know as much as I like about Cajun cookin, so I'm no expert. I've had gumbo that could stand on the end of a fork, and I've had it require a spoon. I'm inclined to say that anything poured over rice SHOULD be a stew, not a soup.:)

ForeverBlowingBubbles

12-10-2008, 05:42 PM

I am now hungry. thanks guys. :mad:

weezie

12-10-2008, 05:48 PM

Webster calls it a sauce. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/chili)

Ben's Chili Bowl in DC and Coney Islands in Detroit would definitely agree with that.

In this house, it's more of a stew. Just made some venison chili the other night.

Fish80

12-10-2008, 06:05 PM

This just in: soup you eat with a spoon, stew you eat with a fork.

Chili you eat with a friend. :D

ohioguy2

12-10-2008, 06:07 PM

Venison chili is good stuff. Perhaps the answer to our earth shaking question lies in proportion as much as in content. Beef vegetable soup becomes stew at what point. My wife is calling me for dinner--CHILI and beer. :)

rasputin

12-10-2008, 06:09 PM

I think 2535 has it right. If you start with meat, it's stew.... If you start with water and throw in noodles or veggies or bits of meat, it's soup....

What about gumbo? I believe that starts with roux, which is flour and butter. Is that soup or a stew?

Soup is thin. Chili shouldn't be. My gumbo is on thie thick side, and I serve it over rice, but it is still thinner than a stew. Not all gumbo is made with roux (although mine is). And for roux you can use oil instead of butter (Chef Paul Prudhomme's roux is made with oil).

Soup that has cream or milk in it is sometimes called chowdah. And if it has seafood too, it can be a bisque.

Bostondevil

12-10-2008, 06:26 PM

Top Chef is on tonight. I love Top Chef. Not as much as Project Runway though.

BlueDevilBaby

12-10-2008, 06:35 PM

Ben's Chili Bowl in DC and Coney Islands in Detroit would definitely agree with that.

In this house, it's more of a stew. Just made some venison chili the other night.

Love me some Ben's at Nationals Park. Venison chili sounds delicious. Venison stroganoff is good, too.

Fish80

12-10-2008, 06:47 PM

Why does chili have to be soup or stew? Why can't chili be it's own category? Is a hamburger a sandwich?

rasputin

12-10-2008, 07:08 PM

Why does chili have to be soup or stew? Why can't chili be it's own category? Is a hamburger a sandwich?

Yes, and also remember that Krusty Burger is the official meat-flavored sandwich of the Olympic Games.

DevilAlumna

12-11-2008, 02:52 AM

Do you refer to it as chili soup?

I don't, but my grandmothers both did. They both made it very soup-like as well (not thick at all.) Maybe it was a regional and/or generational thing - midwestern, came of age during the Depression - when soup was a good way to hide the fact that you didn't have much else to put in your pot but liquid.

2535Miles

12-11-2008, 03:19 AM

I don't, but my grandmothers both did. They both made it very soup-like as well (not thick at all.) Maybe it was a regional and/or generational thing - midwestern, came of age during the Depression - when soup was a good way to hide the fact that you didn't have much else to put in your pot but liquid.
Depending on the sources, history says that your midwestern chili should've been thick and chunky with very little 'broth' but the spirit of your grandmothers' chili is spot on on with the creation of both stews and soup. It's an interesting thought; soups and stews both share a kindred spirit in that 'it's time to get rid of all the vegetables and meat before they go bad so lets make a pot of ...'.

I also like Hoppin' John which, like chili, is a STEW!

dukemomLA

12-11-2008, 05:06 AM

Chili is DEFINATELY NOT a soup! I wouldn't even call it a stew. Chili is Chili. Add some great options of condiments -- diced onions, sour cream, shredded cheese, and then some corn bread with honey butter and/or garlic bread, and you have a great meal.

But again, Chili is Chili (con carne or not).

It deserves a class of itself.

Ben63

12-11-2008, 07:54 AM

Chili is not a soup, it is not a stew, it is chili.

But if I HAD to classify it as a soup or stew, I would say stew.

devil84

12-11-2008, 08:33 AM

Chili is a stew.

Soup is vegetables and/or meat cooked in liquid. Soups can be served hot or cold, and are always served in bowls (or mugs).

Stews are meat and vegetables cooked in enough liquid to cover, and is cooked for a long time over low heat to tenderize the meat. (Yes, there are vegetarian and quick-cooking versions of stews and chili, but those are more modern variants of the original idea). Stews are served hot, and may be thick enough to serve on a plate, sometimes served over rice or noodles.

Chili fits the stew definition better, as most recipes require long, slow cooking.

Lavabe

12-11-2008, 11:51 AM

... then I want it to count as a soup for special "soup & salad" deals at good places.

Of course, over here, we get the Cincinnati variety of chili, which is served on spaghetti.

Cheers,
Lavabe

rsvman

12-11-2008, 01:32 PM

1. Chili is NOT a soup.

2. I loves me some Cincinnati chili. If you haven't tried it, you need to. Kind of like a regular chili but with a bit of a cinnamon and/or allspice taste to it, and served over spaghetti noodles. Top it with onions, grated cheese, kidney beans as desired and serve it up with oyster crackers. Yummy.

Lavabe

12-11-2008, 01:36 PM

Ben63

12-11-2008, 03:46 PM

Skyline or GoldStar?:D

Skyline 4 ways (no onions)

ohioguy2

12-11-2008, 03:51 PM

I still want to know at what point does beef vegetable soup become stew?

Skyline is great--

Our chili last night was very, very good. The Great Lakes Porter was not too bad either!:p

Acymetric

12-11-2008, 04:14 PM

Skyline or GoldStar?:D

I've held a grudge against Skyline for the past oh...5 years? I was at a convention in Cinci for high school kids. We were walking around and found a Skyline Chili. There was this sign there. "Authentic Southern Sweet Tea" it said. I love me some sweet tea, and we were going to be there for a week, so I was all for checking it out.

Fast forward to us getting served. I take a sip of my "Authentic Southern Sweet Tea" and it is the worst thing I've ever drank. It was terrible. I've eaten at Skyline exactly one time since. It was probably about 6 months ago, and only because I was with about 10 friends who were all dead set on eating there. It wasn't bad, but when I can avoid it, I'll never go back. Lying about tea is a cardinal sin.

BD80

12-11-2008, 07:33 PM

Is chili a soup?

Did anyone think to ask the chili what it wants to be? With a typical bean content, chili can speak for itself. Often unprompted.

This whole discussion could be severely undermining the emotional development of the chili.

My chili fancies itself to be a meat entrée with flavorful sauce (and legumes). Similar to pot roast or steak teryiaki. Serving it on a bed of pasta sounds interesting, it might please the chili and my sons.

devildeac

12-12-2008, 12:04 AM

Did anyone think to ask the chili what it wants to be? With a typical bean content, chili can speak for itself. Often unprompted.

This whole discussion could be severely undermining the emotional development of the chili.

My chili fancies itself to be a meat entrée with flavorful sauce (and legumes). Similar to pot roast or steak teryiaki. Serving it on a bed of pasta sounds interesting, it might please the chili and my sons.

Chili is regularly served that way in Cincinnati.