Could a Private University change over to a Public Unversity?

[ForeverBlowingBubbles]

For example, could Duke (or any private school) ever join the UNC school system (or whatever schools own state system)?

This is just theoretical. I'm not saying it should be done.

Just a few shallow pro's would be

1) increase popularity of the football program

2) make it affordable for kids that are smart enough to get in (in NC) but not smart enough to get a full ride.

3) maybe make exchanging scientific data locally easier.

Some con's would be

1) Dropping a few levels in Prestige?

2) ..........

[rthomas]

A university such as Duke might lose it's endowment by becoming public.

[colchar]

Canada has virtually no private universities but a couple that we have had eventually switched to fully public so I don't see why an American school couldn't do the same.

[Cavlaw]

Canada has virtually no private universities but a couple that we have had eventually switched to fully public so I don't see why an American school couldn't do the same.
That's a great point, because everything in U.S. is exactly the same as Canada, and if something can be done there, then there would be absolutely no issues doing it here...

[hurleyfor3]

One obvious con is that you lose a lot of control over funding -- what gets funded and by how much is largely up to the board of regents (or whatever it's called in NC) and state legislators. And they have other interests to keep happy, such as taxpayers.

Tangentially related thought: Durham sucks. Let's move Duke somewhere else! (Assume we can come up with the $billion or so necessary for this, which is not completely far-fetched.) So where?

[Jeffrey]

For example, could Duke ever join the UNC school system?

BLASPHEMY!

[blublood]

Yeah, I mean I guess it could be done, but why would you want to? This year has emphasized the precarious position of public universities in our state. We're taking a 35% cut in the higher ed budget this year; K-12 is being cut 5%. We're currently in a wage freeze which means no raises this year, and a hiring freeze will probably follow suit in the next 12 months or so (depending on how long the economy continues to suck).

On the other hand, I interviewed recently with a private university and asked specifically about the higher ed cuts and how they might affects the positions. The general response was, "Huh?" This particular school has a generous endowment so it just doesn't matter - good times, bad times, they can still keep tuition down, employees and faculty happy, and students coming in the doors. That's huge. You do *not* want to lose that kind of security and control over your institution unless there's no other choice.

[unexpected]

This is totally pie-in-the-sky, but if I could, I would move Duke to some sleepy town in the Appalachians. Maybe Boone?

Or wouldn't it be cool if Duke was in OBX?

Though I'd settle for moving it to Cary.

[hurleyfor3]

This is totally pie-in-the-sky, but if I could, I would move Duke to some sleepy town in the Appalachians. Maybe Boone?

Or wouldn't it be cool if Duke was in OBX?

Though I'd settle for moving it to Cary.

I was thinking Brevard or Waynesville. As for the coast, Duke already has a presence in Beaufort, so that might be the best option. If we want to go bigger, Charlotte would kill to have Duke.

I agree we should stay in NC.

[dukechem]

Back in the 60s, the Chancellor of Pitt ran it into a hole financially with his grandiose plans, and Pitt became state-affiliated. As an alumn, I should know more of the details, but I do know that it has led to reduced tuition for in-state students. I don't know how much control the state exerts over the institution.

[dukechem]

I think there may have been one or two other institutions in Pennsylvania that became state-affiliated as well as Pitt (Temple?) so this is not unheard of.

Several schools in Virginia have talked about going in the other direction because of the lack of state support. UVa is one as was the Univ of Mary Washington and, I believe, W&M. I believe UVa has gained some autonomy in its operations as a result.

[hurleyfor3]

Back in the 60s, the Chancellor of Pitt ran it into a hole financially with his grandiose plans, and Pitt became state-affiliated. As an alumn, I should know more of the details, but I do know that it has led to reduced tuition for in-state students. I don't know how much control the state exerts over the institution.

Was that the result of overspending on all the stuff they built on top of Forbes Field -- the Hillman Library, the law school building, etc?

[allenmurray]

Though I'd settle for moving it to Cary.

Very few of the buildings on campus would pass the aesthetic architecture codes in Cary - two-stories, 80s faux-colonial, and beige. We would even have to change our school colors from Blue and White to tan and taupe.

[ForeverBlowingBubbles]

Very few of the buildings on campus would pass the aesthetic architecture codes in Cary - two-stories, 80s faux-colonial, and beige. We would even have to change our school colors from Blue and White to tan and taupe.

Charlotte would probably be the best bet. No one in Charlotte really cares about the 49'ers kind of the same way no one in Wilmington cares about the Seahawks (and with TEAL as our main color, and the name SEAHAWKS, yeah I'd wear that T-shirt... I mean uh.... chicks and beer)

[Cavlaw]

I think there may have been one or two other institutions in Pennsylvania that became state-affiliated as well as Pitt (Temple?) so this is not unheard of.

Several schools in Virginia have talked about going in the other direction because of the lack of state support. UVa is one as was the Univ of Mary Washington and, I believe, W&M. I believe UVa has gained some autonomy in its operations as a result.
UVa law declared financial independence from the state several years ago, gaining a greater degree of autonomy and control over its own accounts. Virginia residents are still preferred for admission (and I believe tuition) based on historical contributions to the school by the state.

[TNTDevil]

Though I'd settle for moving it to Cary.

Blasphemy!

[willywoody]

College of Charleston was a municipal college for 100 years before becoming a state school in 1970.

I'm thinking Winthrop was private for a while before becoming a state school. (actually i just confirmed it, but it was only for about 5 years in the late 1800's!)

[Bluedog]

One obvious con is that you lose a lot of control over funding -- what gets funded and by how much is largely up to the board of regents (or whatever it's called in NC) and state legislators. And they have other interests to keep happy, such as taxpayers.

Tangentially related thought: Durham sucks. Let's move Duke somewhere else! (Assume we can come up with the $billion or so necessary for this, which is not completely far-fetched.) So where?

When Duke moved from Trinity, NC, in 1892, they got an offer of land from Raleigh....But then Julian S. Carr offered more land in Durham then the offer from Raleigh, so Trinity College moved to Durham instead.

Also, Cornell has done this. It used to be 100% private. Now 4 of its schools within the university are "state-supported" although I don't know if they're fully "public."

[Jarhead]

Suggesting a change to go public is as dumb as it gets. It serves no purpose. Actually, that is not correct. Moving away from Durham would be even dumber. No, No, that's wrong, too. Just talking about either idea is the dumbest.

[brevity]

Though I'd settle for moving it to Cary.

Bad idea. Everything in Cary closes at 10pm. Even some of the traffic lights!

I say Duke stays in Durham, but opens up a Far West Campus in Chapel Hill, just to spite the Heels. Bonus: we can put an end to that whole "only 8 miles separates them" talk.

[hurleyfor3]

Actually, that is not correct. Moving away from Durham would be even dumber.

Why? Was it dumb for Wake Forest to move? As I originally mentioned, assume the money is there. I acknowledge replacing Cameron would be a drawback.

[Jarhead]

Why? Was it dumb for Wake Forest to move? As I originally mentioned, assume the money is there. I acknowledge replacing Cameron would be a drawback.
Reynolds funded the move of that University to Winston-Salem, but it left Wake Forest behind. It was just a small college with nothing expensive to move. It was sort of like Duke moving from East Campus to a newly constructed campus a couple of miles away, absent the name change. The Baptist Seminary stayed behind, as I recall. What would it cost to move today's Duke University anywhere? Probably as much as moving the US Capital to Kansas City. Warren Buffit and Bill Gates combined resources? They would ask, "Why?"

[unexpected]

of course it's a silly question. It's july, give us a break! At least we're not debating for the nth time next year's starting five or predicting Olek's first All-American season!

It's a THOUGHT experiment. Nothing wrong with that.

...I wish we had a city like Charleston. Do we really need a big city? Can't we just have a sleepy college town that just absolutely adores us?

[Jmac1970]

Just out of curiosity, does an endowment the exclusive domain of private schools? For example, the University of Michigan has an endowment of 8 billion (1 billion more than Duke). As a public school is that money regulated differently? I am just wondering considering the conversation regarding the possibility of losing the endowment should one go public.

[hurleyfor3]

Just out of curiosity, does an endowment the exclusive domain of private schools? For example, the University of Michigan has an endowment of 8 billion (1 billion more than Duke). As a public school is that money regulated differently? I am just wondering considering the conversation regarding the possibility of losing the endowment should one go public.

The University of Texas system (UTIMCO) has a Huge endowment fund, above and beyond what the state funds the system with every year.

Individuals can certainly endow scholarships or professorships at public universities; that's what the Ram's Club is for.

[RelativeWays]

Duke could never afford to move its entire campus from Durham to anywhere else, it would be a logistical and financial nightmare. The Wake Forest move doesn't even compare because over 60 years ago and the school was much much smaller than it is now.

[dukechem]

Was that the result of overspending on all the stuff they built on top of Forbes Field -- the Hillman Library, the law school building, etc?

It actually predates the demolition of Forbes Field. I left Pitt in 1964, and the changeover occurred a few years after that but before 1970, I think.

Chancellor Litchfield [first Oakland (the section of Pittsburgh where Pitt is located), then the World] had big ideas. There was a plan to fill in the ravine next to Schenley Park with a building among other things. I recall a model in the Cathedral with all the changes.