Moon Landing Hoax - Need Debunk Help

[EarlJam]

I don't believe the conspiracy theorists. I believe we went and landed on the moon as documented.

But I found this and it's the only thing I can't find debunked - and I admit, unless it's simply video that has been altered, it is bothering me.

This guy seems to be a loon, and I've found things to debunk nearly everything he says.

BUT, look at the 2:13 mark of this video. I can't explain that or find an explanation on the Web. No way does a person just "float up" like that without help.

Insights? Again, I'm not one of those who belives we faked the mission. Just looking for some intellgent insight into this mystery at the 2:13 mark O' this video:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=9CKklqaUzvU

-EJ

P.S. Again, this guy seems to be a kook who is using this mostly to pimp his own crappy production company (:40 seconds in - it's horrible). But still, how to explain the other?

[CameronBornAndBred]

Funny timing, just earlier I read a complete debunking of all the hoax/ conspirator arguments. It can be found here (http://www.braeunig.us/space/hoax.htm), it's a very good read.

I think instead of coming up with all the reasons why it's faked, my time is better spent in amazement that we accomplished such an incredible feat multiple times. Stuff like that makes me real proud to be American.

P.S. I've read that someone is doing a remake of Capricorn One, the movie about how NASA fakes a manned mission to Mars. The lander crashes coming back home in real life, so they gotta bump off the astronauts/actors. Think Apollo 13 drama, turning out badly. They would then have to kill off the real life astronauts so the story would stick.

[cspan37421]

Debunking the moon landing hoax is covered thoroughly in Phil Plait's book, Bad Astronomy. See if your local library has it.

[wilson]

Wow. Thanks for this thread. The page responding to all of the erroneous hoax claims is really interesting; that guy obviously knows his stuff very well.

[alteran]

Debunking the moon landing hoax is covered thoroughly in Phil Plait's book, Bad Astronomy. See if your local library has it.

Or just go to his website, which is riddled with debunking info.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/apollohoax.html

[EarlJam]

Wow. Thanks for this thread. The page responding to all of the erroneous hoax claims is really interesting; that guy obviously knows his stuff very well.

Indeed. And it answers many of the questions. But there's one I still can't find a credible "debunk" to - the one mentioned in the original post. At that point in the film, the astronaut indeeds seems to be lifted from the moon's surface. It's very odd.

Again, we went to the moon. I'm sure of that. Just looking to debunk all things debunkable - and that video is just puzzling to me.

-EJ

[alteran]

Indeed. And it answers many of the questions. But there's one I still can't find a credible "debunk" to - the one mentioned in the original post. At that point in the film, the astronaut indeeds seems to be lifted from the moon's surface. It's very odd.

Again, we went to the moon. I'm sure of that. Just looking to debunk all things debunkable - and that video is just puzzling to me.

-EJ


I haven't looked at the video yet, but I'll check it later.

My bottom line, though, is you can't debunk everything, and you shouldn't try. I say this as both a debunker and a conspiracy theorist myself.

Conspiracy theory people fall into two camps, the true believers and the rest. You can reach the rest, and with them you DON'T have to debunk everything-- just hit them with overwhelming evidence, which for many conspiracy theories (like this one) just isn't that hard.

But the true believers cannot be swayed, trying to sway them is a fool's errand. In the time it takes you to research, debunk and document one point, they can make up six others. The conspiracy people will ultimately put you in a position of having to disprove a negative. And sometimes you'll utterly and completely destroy some point, only to see them post the same thing three posts later as if what you wrote five minutes before doesn't exist.

It's kind of like a non-political PPB. :D

The best you can do is hit them with so much stuff that they look foolish for refusing to concede to those who still haven't lost their thinking caps.

Good luck.

[hurleyfor3]

The best argument that the SIX manned moon expeditions (Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 and 17) were legit is that our government is nowhere near savvy enough to have faked them and kept it a secret this long.

[snowdenscold]

The best argument that the SIX manned moon expeditions (Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 and 17) were legit is that our government is nowhere near savvy enough to have faked them and kept it a secret this long.

Haha, agreed. It's much more plausible we really sent people to the moon. Occam's Razor FTW.

[CameronBlue]

I guess this thread is appropriate for similar nuttiness about conspiracy theories. Check it out. Compelling experts and reputable former military commanders claim that UFOs are monitoring and at times interfering in our nuclear weapons programs.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2008/07/20/lkl.ufo.long.cnn

Proof that aliens can't recognize the exigency of threats to the existence of man? The Presidency of GWB.

[hurleyfor3]

I guess this thread is appropriate for similar nuttiness about conspiracy theories. Check it out. Compelling experts and reputable former military commanders claim that UFOs are monitoring and at times interfering in our nuclear weapons programs.


Wait a sec -- the number of nucelar warheads detonated in acts of war since 1945 is zero. So without the aliens' interference, we would have blown ourselves up by now? And not blowing ourselves up is an outcome the aliens tried to achieve? Why bother?

[gus]

Unless you enjoy sisyphean tasks, I wouldn't bother.

Debating people who believe the moon landing was faked is like debating creationists and 9/11 conspiracy nuts. No amount of fact, logic or evidence is ever sufficient.

[CameronBlue]

Well I don't want to seem ungrateful but apparently they see disease, conventional warfare, species extinction, etc as less worthwhile causes. On the other hand clearly they're disturbed by global warming and have assigned a lower level emissary to the task. Bet they're using ol Al's Oscar as a hood ornament on the Mother Ship.

[CameronBlue]

Wait a sec -- the number of nucelar warheads detonated in acts of war since 1945 is zero. So without the aliens' interference, we would have blown ourselves up by now? And not blowing ourselves up is an outcome the aliens tried to achieve? Why bother?

Apparently you're not a Spielberg fan. Thanks to him they're not as misunderstood as they once were. It's the new alien reality.

[alteran]

This guy seems to be a loon, and I've found things to debunk nearly everything he says.

BUT, look at the 2:13 mark of this video. I can't explain that or find an explanation on the Web. No way does a person just "float up" like that without help.

Insights?

Look closely at the left arm of the astronaut rising. (Relative to us, it is on the right.) It's hard to see because with the poor video footage, the white of the NASA outfit and the oversaturated light gray of the moon look virtually identical. But when he gets up, you can see the striping near the wrist as he pulls his arm in. Now that you know what to look for, you'll be able to see it from the beginning of the footage, thoughtfully replayed about three times in this segment-- the rising astronaut is pushing off the hand/arm of the other astronaut using his left arm.

It looks weird and unlikely because the guy is in 1/6th gravity and can raise himself with very little pressure.

I spotted this without paying attention to the audio. But the audio confirms it. The narrator actually quotes the relevant dialog from the standing astronaut which clarifies the whole thing-- "let me give you hand." It's somewhat obscured, but it's obvious that's exactly what happened.

But the narrator is so determined to see a conspiracy that he doesn't even check the obvious ramification of the words.

In the immortal words of Vinny Gambini: "Everyting dis guy just said is bullsh**."

And, I might add-- "I'm troo wid dis guy."

--alteran

[Bluedawg]

Look closely at the left arm of the astronaut rising. (Relative to us, it is on the right.) It's hard to see because with the poor video footage, the white of the NASA outfit and the oversaturated light gray of the moon look virtually identical. But when he gets up, you can see the striping near the wrist as he pulls his arm in. Now that you know what to look for, you'll be able to see it from the beginning of the footage, thoughtfully replayed about three times in this segment-- the rising astronaut is pushing off the hand/arm of the other astronaut using his left arm.

It looks weird and unlikely because the guy is in 1/6th gravity and can raise himself with very little pressure.

I spotted this without paying attention to the audio. But the audio confirms it. The narrator actually quotes the relevant dialog from the standing astronaut which clarifies the whole thing-- "let me give you hand." It's somewhat obscured, but it's obvious that's exactly what happened.

But the narrator is so determined to see a conspiracy that he doesn't even check the obvious ramification of the words.

In the immortal words of Vinny Gambini: "Everyting dis guy just said is bullsh**."

And, I might add-- "I'm troo wid dis guy."

--alteran

Thanks...You are correct. When i focused on that arm i could see him using the other astronaut as leverage. I had focused on what he wanted us to see...how it appeared that the backpack was pulling him up which took my focus away from the arms. Its an old magician's technique that still works very effectively. You make the audience look at what you want them to look at so they don’t see what is actually happening.

I didn’t respond to this originally because I knew someone on this board would figure it out. Good job!

[colchar]

I think instead of coming up with all the reasons why it's faked, my time is better spent in amazement that we accomplished such an incredible feat multiple times. Stuff like that makes me real proud to be American.



Don't forget to give credit to all of the German rocket scientists who made it over to America after the war.

[colchar]

Bet they're using ol Al's Oscar as a hood ornament on the Mother Ship.

Post (or quote) of the week!!!

[EarlJam]

Don't forget to give credit to all of the German rocket scientists who made it over to America after the war.

1963, Somewhere in America:

Steve: Ahhhhhhhhhhh Hans! It's so good to see you again!

Hans: Ja. Guten morgen Herr Jones! Die brot and beiren ist wunderbar!

Steve: Good morning to you. Look. (pulls Hans aside) I've been meaning to talk to you about the latest results of the test firings.

Hans: Wircklick? Warum? Alles ist gut, ja?

Steve: Well, to be truthful, the trajectory of the last for test firings were off by five percent before maximum hulti-ceilio-sphere was even reached. The target ended up being missed by more than 1,000 yards.

Hans: Das ist nicht gut?

Steve: (shaking head). Hans, Hans, Hans. Why no. That would be like a V2 missing London alltogether, or a Stuka missing the Belgian Royal Museam of Art and having the bomb drop wastefully into the English Channel!

Hans: Oh. Scheizer.

Steve: Why does this have to be so difficult. I mean, it's not like it's rocket science!
(akward pause)

Hans (grinning): Ahhhhhhhhhhhh, Tatsächlich ist es!

(Hans points jokingly at Steve, Steve returns the same gesture - both break out in immediate uproarious laughter).

Freeze Frame.

Roll Credits, with a special "Thank You" to the German Rocket Scientists that made it over to The United States of America, after the skirmish of '39 - '45.

-EarlJam

[UVaAmbassador]

Unless you enjoy sisyphean tasks, I wouldn't bother.

Debating people who believe the moon landing was faked is like debating creationists and 9/11 conspiracy nuts. No amount of fact, logic or evidence is ever sufficient.

Thanks. Thanks a bunch.

[EarlJam]

Oh Snap.

You are so completely correct. Seriously. THANK YOU!


In addition to everything you said (which becomes obvious after watching the video again), there is a dark piece of the spacesuit that LOOKS like his dangling left arm, but it isn't. Now that I've read your post, this video looks quite normal.

Dang and fo shizzle! Holy Perry Mason!

-EJ

P.S. Also, the foonkle-dink narrating this piece reminds me of the villan in Die Hard. For that, and because he's a self shrilling shilling moron forces me to pronounce the following:

Narrator of the "Moon Hoax" video and shirtty production company: may you burn in HELL!



Look closely at the left arm of the astronaut rising. (Relative to us, it is on the right.) It's hard to see because with the poor video footage, the white of the NASA outfit and the oversaturated light gray of the moon look virtually identical. But when he gets up, you can see the striping near the wrist as he pulls his arm in. Now that you know what to look for, you'll be able to see it from the beginning of the footage, thoughtfully replayed about three times in this segment-- the rising astronaut is pushing off the hand/arm of the other astronaut using his left arm.

It looks weird and unlikely because the guy is in 1/6th gravity and can raise himself with very little pressure.

I spotted this without paying attention to the audio. But the audio confirms it. The narrator actually quotes the relevant dialog from the standing astronaut which clarifies the whole thing-- "let me give you hand." It's somewhat obscured, but it's obvious that's exactly what happened.

But the narrator is so determined to see a conspiracy that he doesn't even check the obvious ramification of the words.

In the immortal words of Vinny Gambini: "Everyting dis guy just said is bullsh**."

And, I might add-- "I'm troo wid dis guy."

--alteran